What is the difference between Scaled Agile/SAFe and a Product Operating Model? (Interview on the Business Agility Now Podcast)

I recently joined Adam Mattis on the “Business Agility Now” podcast for a conversation about scaling agile and product operating models. It’s always a pleasure to chat with Adam about the realities of applying agility at scale and some of the trends I’m seeing in the field.

We covered a wide range of topics, drawing from our experience helping organizations work through the complexity of business agility in different environments.

Here are some of the key themes and topics we focused on:

• The enduring principles of product management: We explored the idea that while applying technology to product management is relatively new, the core discipline itself has deep roots in consumer goods industries.

• The growing awareness of product orientation: Organizations that initially focused solely on agile project management are now recognizing the need to become genuinely product-oriented to achieve business outcomes.

• Product ownership vs. product management: We discussed the differences between these roles, drawing parallels with category management and product line management in consumer goods.

• The challenge of centralized decision-making: In many enterprises, true decision-making authority lives far above the designated product managers and product owners, leading to the “feature scribe” phenomenon.

• The “backlog owner” reality: Many people with the title of “product owner” are essentially backlog managers without true product ownership responsibilities.

• The buzz around the Product Operating Model: We explored whether product operating models represent a genuine shift in perspective or just new terminology for old problems. An emphasis on empowered product teams and steering with evidence is a key part of the model.

• SAFe and product orientation: We discussed how a strong foundation in agility, using frameworks like Scrum or SAFe, can support a product-oriented approach. There’s a real opportunity to use the product-oriented movement to re-emphasize core agile and SAFe principles, such as focusing on objectives and outcomes in PI Planning.

• The foundational prerequisites for product centricity: Before organizations can truly embrace a product-centric view, they need foundations such as DevOps, CI/CD, clear product definitions, and aligned teams.

• The power of product-oriented portfolio conversations: Shifting the focus at the portfolio level from managing a book of work to emphasizing outcome-oriented strategic themes and leading indicators can change the conversation.

• The critical role of incentives: To become product-centric, organizations need to align incentives to reward product performance rather than just project outputs.

• The consultant as an “interventionist”: Adam coined the term “Enterprise Interventionist.” We emphasized the importance of providing appropriate interventions and having the courage to say “no” when the conditions for success aren’t there.

• The potential synergy between SAFe and the Product Operating Model: I shared my experience that SAFe and the Product Operating Model aren’t in conflict. They can complement each other, with SAFe providing structure for the execution that a product operating model needs.

Throughout our conversation, we emphasized the need to move beyond just adopting new terms and to focus on the hard work required to create truly product-oriented organizations that deliver tangible business value.

If you’re interested in these topics and want to hear our full discussion, listen to the entire podcast episode or watch it on YouTube.

As a follow-up to these ideas, I recently released a free email course called the “Portfolio Agility Trail Map.” It offers insights and tips for those looking to make their scaled agile organizations / portfolios more product-oriented. If you’d like to explore this further, check it out.

I’d love to hear your thoughts on these topics. Feel free to connect and share your experiences.

Watch the podcast conversation on YouTube.

Questions about scaling agility, Kanban, or organizational transformation? Explore advisory options or let’s talk.